an observation about bynames

[marycatelli]

If your world does not have family names, if people of the same name are distingiushed from each other by bynames. . . .

Don't make them all the same pattern.

The one I see most often is that they are Name the Adjective.  All of them.  At the very least, some would be Adjective Name.  Little John.  Fat David.  Red Robert.  More likely they would be varied by locatives -- John of the Woods, Jack under the Mountain, Sally Meadows -- and occupational references -- Alice Webster, Wilma Alewife, John Smith -- and patronymics -- Roberta Robin's daughter -- or even matronomics, even in a patrilineal society, if the father is unknown, or the mother is higher ranking or has the more forceful personality so she's the one people think of, or just has the more distinctive name -- Robert Maud's son.

And when using the adjectives, they tend to go for the obvious, not the flattering.  Calling a man "John the Loyal" is unlike; "John the Lean" is more likely.  And they were less hypersensitive to slights.  As witness one Chinese informant who was flabbergasted that a sociologist thought he might object to being known as "the stutterer."  He stuttered.  Why wouldn't they identify him so?

Also, they change.  There's one historical character who in his own time was known as "William the Bastard" and "William the Fat" as well as the one that is generally used in histories:  "William the Conqueror."  (It was the middle one.  "Bastard" was youthful, and "Fat" was old age.)

Comments

[bunn.livejournal.com]

Doesn't that depend on the language(s) involved?

I grew up in south Wales where nicknames are widely used because so many people are called Jones, and so far as I recall, all of them were 'Jones the something'. There was Jones the Milk and the guy who delivered fizzy lemonade in bottles was Jones the Pop, and ISTR there was a guy in the brass band who was known as Jones the Trombone...

In English you can stick a byname either side of a name and it still makes sense, but I think in Welsh that may not be the case, and the habit persists even when the speakers are actually all using English.

[marycatelli]

True, the grammatical structures may limit things.

[headnoises.livejournal.com]

For the Scottish, too-- my dad's family has a lot of Mary's.

The first one I realized that it was a nickname was "Sweet Mary"-- my dad's cousin's Samoan wife, who's pretty heavy. (For when the identifiers are insulting TO THE PERSON GIVING THE NAME; might be useful to do world-building.)

At least with our family, you end up with things like "Our John's Mary" (wife) or "Old Glory's William." (Son, unless the father is also William or William is very young in which case it's Little William; Our John's Little Mary would be a daughter. Side-effect of the namers being female, I think, though. Kids "belong" to their mother, generally.)

[marycatelli]

Well, one would think of children by the adult they're normally about.

There's an observation that Little John, despite the later ironic effect, might have stemmed from nothing more than that same locution: "Little" meaning "Junior."

L. M. Montgomery had two cousins once called "Little Sam" and "Big Sam." Problem was, they were named as children, and Big Sam was the elder by ten years. You can guess what happened.

[headnoises.livejournal.com]

Old Batman's nephew, The Kid, was in his 60s last I knew-- I've got an uncle named "Fat" that could be a stand-in for Random Cowboy Made Of Rawhide in any movie.

Names get made when there's a need to distinguish and a difference. So you might get something like "Bear Slayer!" Or you might get "Curly."

[marycatelli]

Yup. You just have to remember that people differ in all sorts of ways, so people won't always use the same difference.