cliches and resonance

[marycatelli]

One needs to have a lot of respect for cliches.  Nothing gets to be a cliche without good reason, because without good reason, it would not get used over and over and over and over again. . . .


Which means it has to resonate emotionally or carry plot forward effectively or delineate character effectively.  I have actually heard grumbles that a wise old man the characters meet will know things to help them.  Like a wise old man who does nothing for them is plot-relevent enough to be mentioned.  The death of the mentor -- how else can the student show he is his equal except by managing without him?  With bonus points for providing a motivation, too.

Then again, cliches are notorious for having no resonance, for having all the emotion drained out of them by over-use. . . .

It can be hard to judge because it's subjective.  Not just in how often you've seen it before, but how well it resonated for you.  A cliche that carries a lot of punch for you can still be powerful when the cool kids are saying it's oh so five minutes ago.

Comments

[ford-prefect42.livejournal.com]

I have often said: "stereotypes are how the unedcated perform statistical analysis". Cliches, stereotypes, etcetera, are all very useful things, all of them come into existence for *reasons*, and those reasons are usually that they are observably true of the majority of the group in question.

[marycatelli]

Stereotypes are how the educated perform most statistical analysis, too. Jumping to conclusions is human nature, because if you take a broad-minded approach to the long, thin thing by your foot, sooner or later you're a snake-bite victim.

[jennygordon.livejournal.com]

It can sometimes be fun to flip a cliche on its head .... although, of course, if too many people do that, it in itself can become a cliche!

[marycatelli]

Only if it works.

Having the student murdered and thus enraging the mentor might, if you managed to avoid annoying the audience with a bait-and-switch POV.

But a wise old man of no significance would only work as comic relief, and probably too many insignificant characters would not work even if they were all comic, because it's hard to clutter up the story and still have it work.

[ford-prefect42.livejournal.com]

The "enraged mentor" has the drawback that the mentor is *assumed* badass. It's less challenging to see him doing the heroics, he's been doing them for 50 years. So the heroics have to go over the top to make it work.

[marycatelli]

Except that if he's done them for fifty years, he's probably old and frailer than he was. Give him an old wound or two and the question of whether he's still go it is crucial.

Then, you do have to do something like that to finesse the matter, unlike the student.