Mud and Blood in Fantasy

[marycatelli]

The description on this was a bit off -- it spoke of works where you slog through the mud and are morally ambiguous -- which isn't a necessary correlation.  That didn't get much play at the discussion though.


The slums, the poor, the grinding poverty thereof.  (It didn't come up that this tends to be sword & sorcery, if I remember rightly.)

The selective use of realism to include such salacious details as appeal to the writer, or his intended audience.

A Game of Thrones came up, surprise.  Too much violence for their taste -- and one panelist objected to the notion that no one could kill Tyrion, who's only a dwarf.  I think this was the panel where two panelists objected on the grounds it lacked gender equality.  They were willing to concede that it could be allowed in a historical setting but that in an imaginary world, it was required, and they wanted it.  (I thought, but did not say -- did not even try to -- that what occurred historically is a legitimate think to base your world-building on.)

Hmm.  Come to think of it, magic and how it impacts mud and blood would be a major topic, but it didn't come up, and I didn't even notice.  Perhaps I shall write on that myself.

Comments

[nagasvoice.livejournal.com]

I'd think your magic system might have major impact on how much dirt regular living involves, at least. While some folks tend to assume that *all* blood magic would be evol (a nice assumption on which to base fictional mixups and misunderstandings, to be sure!) there are also some magic types depend on being "grounded" in several senses of the word.

[marycatelli]

Now that would really enliven the question of realism.

One wonders if they could make dirt sanitary, and if that would affect the magic.

[nagasvoice.livejournal.com]

Actually, the term "sanitary" under the circumstances is an interesting one. Most dirt in general is full of benign, beneficial organisms--very much a live community, with varying activity levels depending on the climate etc--and sterilizing it is sort of like scorching your body with Really Serious antibiotics. These days, the doctors give out cultures, like super-plus concentrated yoghurt, to reinstate your normal intestinal flora and prevent various problems associated with the Wrong Bugs Taking Over Instead of the Good Ones.
Which leads to the interesting world-building scenario that some magic systems (like some medical ones) think scorched earth is the way to go (tough out the ensuing issues, unless of course it kills you) and others think that leads to problems, can't we find a better way around the original problem?

[marycatelli]

In the days of plentiful dirt, there were probably enough sources of readily available germs to make it Not A Problem.

One charity once asked in a Third World country what it could do to improve health. It was told -- make shoes! Parasites were the biggest threat.

Which brings to mind that the panel did not bring up disease, which tends to get brushed over in even the grittiest settings.

[nagasvoice.livejournal.com]

Agreed on the issue of not thinking of disease as a mud/blood issue. I do recall somebody saying that the greatest public health advance of the 20th Century was... cheap plastic flipflops for the Third World. At one fell swoop it stops a lot of parasitic infestations, as well as preventing more of the open cuts and splits on the feet.

[marycatelli]

quite plausible

[headnoises.livejournal.com]

Hollywood illness-- the only time people are sick are if it's a plot point.

[marycatelli]

Ah, but if you're going for "realism" you can throw it in just to be unpleasant, just as you can throw in mud or executions or --

[headnoises.livejournal.com]

Harder to use, though. You can have the poor coughing in the background, etc, but... meh, most of the "it's realistic!" stuff ends up being set-dressing or an excuse to be nasty, sadly. Not very realistic at all.

(of course, I do laugh when the series so big on being realistic have characters hopping into bed at the drop of a sword belt....)

[marycatelli]

unrealistic I grant you but the particular selections are always interesting

[michal wojcik (from livejournal.com)]

They were willing to concede that it could be allowed in a historical setting but that in an imaginary world, it was required, and they wanted it.

Oh no, not this argument again. I assume they were okay with the seven kingdoms not being democracies?

[marycatelli]

Did not so much as manage to bring the question of democracy up. 0:)